[sakai2-tcc] Portal Chat stay off by default?

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Neal Caidin-3 Neal Caidin-3
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[sakai2-tcc] Portal Chat stay off by default?

https://confluence.sakaiproject.org/display/TCC/TCC+CLE+Action+Items

The folks on the TCC - CLECC call this morning have not been hearing about any large schools turning on portal chat. Due to performance concerns? There the thinking is that this would not be turned on by default for 2.10, at least.

Sound right?

Thanks,
Neal



Neal Caidin
Sakai CLE Community Coordinator
Skype: nealkdin
Twitter: ncaidin










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Steve Swinsburg-3 Steve Swinsburg-3
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Re: [sakai2-tcc] Portal Chat stay off by default?

Disabling new features by default, when they can easily be turned off, is backwards IMO. Turn it on and IF a performance issue arises, let people turn it off themselves. Otherwise new features are more difficult to surface, are often skipped from an institution's QA process, and make bugs harder to find.

cheers,
Steve


On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Neal Caidin <[hidden email]> wrote:
https://confluence.sakaiproject.org/display/TCC/TCC+CLE+Action+Items

The folks on the TCC - CLECC call this morning have not been hearing about any large schools turning on portal chat. Due to performance concerns? There the thinking is that this would not be turned on by default for 2.10, at least.

Sound right?

Thanks,
Neal



Neal Caidin
Sakai CLE Community Coordinator
Skype: nealkdin
Twitter: ncaidin










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Dr. Chuck Dr. Chuck
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Re: [sakai2-tcc] Portal Chat stay off by default?

It has always been on by default in trunk.  It is just off in 2-9-x

I would say it should be on by default in 4.0 for the reasons Steve mentions.

/Chuck

On Sep 12, 2013, at 8:53 PM, Steve Swinsburg <[hidden email]> wrote:

Disabling new features by default, when they can easily be turned off, is backwards IMO. Turn it on and IF a performance issue arises, let people turn it off themselves. Otherwise new features are more difficult to surface, are often skipped from an institution's QA process, and make bugs harder to find.

cheers,
Steve


On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Neal Caidin <[hidden email]> wrote:
https://confluence.sakaiproject.org/display/TCC/TCC+CLE+Action+Items

The folks on the TCC - CLECC call this morning have not been hearing about any large schools turning on portal chat. Due to performance concerns? There the thinking is that this would not be turned on by default for 2.10, at least.

Sound right?

Thanks,
Neal



Neal Caidin
Sakai CLE Community Coordinator
Skype: nealkdin
Twitter: ncaidin










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Aaron Zeckoski-3 Aaron Zeckoski-3
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Re: [sakai2-tcc] Portal Chat stay off by default?

Having a feature on which has been proven to take servers down because
of performance issues is not OK. Requiring a sysadmin to scramble and
restart their cluster to turn off something during a peak load time is
not OK.
We must think of the people running Sakai first.
I think this needs to be voted on and I will be voting -1 for having
it on in a release. If it should be on then fix the issues with it.
Otherwise it should be off in every release until it works at scale.

-AZ


On Thu, Sep 12, 2013 at 9:04 PM, Charles Severance <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It has always been on by default in trunk.  It is just off in 2-9-x
>
> I would say it should be on by default in 4.0 for the reasons Steve
> mentions.
>
> /Chuck
>
>
> On Sep 12, 2013, at 8:53 PM, Steve Swinsburg <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> Disabling new features by default, when they can easily be turned off, is
> backwards IMO. Turn it on and IF a performance issue arises, let people turn
> it off themselves. Otherwise new features are more difficult to surface, are
> often skipped from an institution's QA process, and make bugs harder to
> find.
>
> cheers,
> Steve
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Neal Caidin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> https://confluence.sakaiproject.org/display/TCC/TCC+CLE+Action+Items
>>
>> The folks on the TCC - CLECC call this morning have not been hearing about
>> any large schools turning on portal chat. Due to performance concerns? There
>> the thinking is that this would not be turned on by default for 2.10, at
>> least.
>>
>> Sound right?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Neal
>>
>>
>>
>> Neal Caidin
>> Sakai CLE Community Coordinator
>> [hidden email]
>> Skype: nealkdin
>> Twitter: ncaidin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sakai2-tcc mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://collab.sakaiproject.org/mailman/listinfo/sakai2-tcc
>>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> sakai2-tcc mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://collab.sakaiproject.org/mailman/listinfo/sakai2-tcc
>



--
Aaron Zeckoski - Software Architect - http://tinyurl.com/azprofile
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Steve Swinsburg-3 Steve Swinsburg-3
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Re: [sakai2-tcc] Portal Chat stay off by default?

I don't see any such issues in Jira [1] that contain prove that portal chat took down a server due to performance issues. Sure, performance needs to be looked at, hence turning it on in trunk and getting more eyes on it.

[1] https://jira.sakaiproject.org/issues/?jql=component%20%3D%20%22portal%20chat%22


On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 11:18 AM, Aaron Zeckoski <[hidden email]> wrote:
Having a feature on which has been proven to take servers down because
of performance issues is not OK. Requiring a sysadmin to scramble and
restart their cluster to turn off something during a peak load time is
not OK.
We must think of the people running Sakai first.
I think this needs to be voted on and I will be voting -1 for having
it on in a release. If it should be on then fix the issues with it.
Otherwise it should be off in every release until it works at scale.

-AZ


On Thu, Sep 12, 2013 at 9:04 PM, Charles Severance <[hidden email]> wrote:
> It has always been on by default in trunk.  It is just off in 2-9-x
>
> I would say it should be on by default in 4.0 for the reasons Steve
> mentions.
>
> /Chuck
>
>
> On Sep 12, 2013, at 8:53 PM, Steve Swinsburg <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> Disabling new features by default, when they can easily be turned off, is
> backwards IMO. Turn it on and IF a performance issue arises, let people turn
> it off themselves. Otherwise new features are more difficult to surface, are
> often skipped from an institution's QA process, and make bugs harder to
> find.
>
> cheers,
> Steve
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Neal Caidin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> https://confluence.sakaiproject.org/display/TCC/TCC+CLE+Action+Items
>>
>> The folks on the TCC - CLECC call this morning have not been hearing about
>> any large schools turning on portal chat. Due to performance concerns? There
>> the thinking is that this would not be turned on by default for 2.10, at
>> least.
>>
>> Sound right?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Neal
>>
>>
>>
>> Neal Caidin
>> Sakai CLE Community Coordinator
>> [hidden email]
>> Skype: nealkdin
>> Twitter: ncaidin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sakai2-tcc mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://collab.sakaiproject.org/mailman/listinfo/sakai2-tcc
>>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> sakai2-tcc mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://collab.sakaiproject.org/mailman/listinfo/sakai2-tcc
>



--
Aaron Zeckoski - Software Architect - http://tinyurl.com/azprofile
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Adrian Fish-2 Adrian Fish-2
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Re: [sakai2-tcc] Portal Chat stay off by default?

In reply to this post by Aaron Zeckoski-3
What issues? The only issues I've ever seen on the list were due to nodes not being able to find each other. Juan's load testing, the only load testing to have been done, highlighted that the poll interval should be configurable and this was done. When he retested he didn't find any performance issues. Another thing that was added, on Chuck's advice, was inactivity detection which results in polling being suspended.

Where is the proof that it takes servers down?

Adrian.


On 13 September 2013 02:18, Aaron Zeckoski <[hidden email]> wrote:
Having a feature on which has been proven to take servers down because
of performance issues is not OK. Requiring a sysadmin to scramble and
restart their cluster to turn off something during a peak load time is
not OK.
We must think of the people running Sakai first.
I think this needs to be voted on and I will be voting -1 for having
it on in a release. If it should be on then fix the issues with it.
Otherwise it should be off in every release until it works at scale.

-AZ


On Thu, Sep 12, 2013 at 9:04 PM, Charles Severance <[hidden email]> wrote:
> It has always been on by default in trunk.  It is just off in 2-9-x
>
> I would say it should be on by default in 4.0 for the reasons Steve
> mentions.
>
> /Chuck
>
>
> On Sep 12, 2013, at 8:53 PM, Steve Swinsburg <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> Disabling new features by default, when they can easily be turned off, is
> backwards IMO. Turn it on and IF a performance issue arises, let people turn
> it off themselves. Otherwise new features are more difficult to surface, are
> often skipped from an institution's QA process, and make bugs harder to
> find.
>
> cheers,
> Steve
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 4:49 AM, Neal Caidin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> https://confluence.sakaiproject.org/display/TCC/TCC+CLE+Action+Items
>>
>> The folks on the TCC - CLECC call this morning have not been hearing about
>> any large schools turning on portal chat. Due to performance concerns? There
>> the thinking is that this would not be turned on by default for 2.10, at
>> least.
>>
>> Sound right?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Neal
>>
>>
>>
>> Neal Caidin
>> Sakai CLE Community Coordinator
>> [hidden email]
>> Skype: nealkdin
>> Twitter: ncaidin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> sakai2-tcc mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://collab.sakaiproject.org/mailman/listinfo/sakai2-tcc
>>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> sakai2-tcc mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://collab.sakaiproject.org/mailman/listinfo/sakai2-tcc
>



--
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